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March 1, 2006 Report – Part 2 of 4
(Continued from Part #1 that ended with Item 5 "Communications")
6. Committee Reports
MOTION to move into Committee of the Whole
(Mitchell / Pearson - CARRIED)
Mayor DiIanni : "Councillor Mitchell, a Motion to move into Committee of the Whole for consideration of the [Committee] Reports, please."
Mitchell : "Moved by myself; Seconded by Councillor Pearson that the Council move into Committee of the Whole for consideration of Committee Reports, Mr. Mayor. Thank you."
Mayor DiIanni : "Thank you. All in favour?" (hear councillors say carried) "That's carried."
6.1 Public Works, Infrastructure and Environment Committee
Report 06-003, February 20, 2006
(McCarthy / McHattie - CARRIED)
Mayor DiIanni : "And, the first report to be considered tonight, of course, is the PWIE [Public Works, Infrastructure and Environment Committee] report. And, the Committee presents its 3 rd report and recommends Item #1" (hear councillors say carried) "#2 . #5" (hear councillors say carried; and hear a glass clink)
"#5, Councillor Bruckler."
REQUEST FOR CLARITY ON - " 5. Waterdown/Aldershot Transportation Master Plan Phase 2 (PW05073a) - (Ward 15 with City Wide Implications) (Item 7.1)
(a) That the Phase 2 Waterdown/Aldershot Transportation Master Plan Study Report from Dillon Consulting Ltd. be endorsed.
(b) That the City of Hamilton, in coordination with the City of Burlington and the Region of Halton, proceed with Phase 3,4,5 of the Waterdown/Aldershot Transportation Master Plan (TMP) Study (Municipal Class Environmental Assessment (EA) process - June 2000). Phases 3,4,5 must also include the items in the original terms of reference for this study that was approved by the City of Burlington and the Former Town of Flamborough and as noted in the Order in Council approving OPA 28. The next phases of the EA process will:
(i) Provide detailed alternative design concept for the preferred solution and environmental study report.
(ii) Address the concerns and questions raised at the Public Information Centres in Phase 2 that are design details properly addressed in Phases 3 and 4.
(c) That a copy of the Report PW05073a be forwarded to the City of Burlington the Regional Municipality of Halton, Niagara Escarpment Commission and the Conservation Authorities. "
(CARRIED)
Bruckler : "Just, Mr. Mayor, with respect to #5, I - and it was - I did raise the one question at the Public Works Committee. And, would just - I've had some conversation with staff. I just want some clarity around that particular question, if I could, perhaps direct that to Ms. Tanner."
"And, that relates to - the question I had raised was the, the one option - the East/West Option north of - I guess, north of Parkside Drive : the cost differential between those two options. The one option that was presented by the resident. And, some of the rationale around the decision - or the recommendation staff are putting forward, please, Mr. Mayor."
Mary Lou Tanner - Manager, Strategic and Environmental Planning : "The option that came forward from the group of residents on Parkside Drive was very similar to one of the options we had considered. There were minor differences in it. But, overall, it was close enough to be very similar to what we called the Total Northern Option ."
"The Northern option is $2.5 million less in cost than the preferred option. But, having said that, there are more significant environmental impacts - particularly in the Lake Medad area of natural and scientific interest, which is a Provincially designated area."
"When we looked at the overall evaluation framework which looks at the natural environment, the social environment, the transportation service, and the economic issues related to a particular transportation option, the option that the residents proposed, actually, was ranked 2 nd overall, not first. So, it's not the recommended option."
"Cost is one factor; it's a minor factor in the evaluation. The more important factors are the social and natural environment. And, that's why the preferred option came out first."
Bruckler : "Thank you. I appreciate that information. I guess - and secondly, because cost is only one of the aspects. But, that cost is not a cost to the rate-payer, but would be recoverable from the Development Charges, Mr. Mayor?"
Mary Lou Tanner - Manager, Strategic and Environmental Planning : "That's correct. It would be recovered from Development Charges."
Mayor DiIanni : "I wonder if the Deputy Mayor would take the Chair. I would like to make a couple of comments on this, as well. Deputy Mayor, if you'll recognize me."
(Councillor Mitchell takes the Chair of the meeting, while Mayor DiIanni speaks to the issue.)
Mayor DiIanni : "Let me begin by saying that, I support the staff recommendation Members of Council. I think that staff has worked long and hard on a long-standing issue that needs to be addressed. It's our obligation, in fact, to address this. It's not an issue that's going to go away. And, I think that everybody - regardless of which side they're on, on this issue - they understand that it has to be addressed."
"I just want to make reference to the community group that I have in Flamborough that advises me and really instructs me on what - from their perspective - is important to their community. And, I've invited both Councillors to join me in that group. And, they have on occasion."
"It's not a group that's contrary to this project. This group is very broad-based. And, one of the interests that they expressed was certainly in the Transportation issues. But, they've tabled about 13 different issues that they're working on to inform themselves, as well as provide some advice to me on Waterdown issues - on Flamborough issues, generally - Waterdown, in this case."
"They have met a number of times. And, I've facilitated a number of meetings with staff. And, our staff was professional and thorough and excellent. They always didn't provide responses that were appreciated, or agreed with. But, staff did, I think - and I was thinking about Mary Lou Tanner, specifically - but, not just Mary Lou. I know that there's a team behind her that did their best in providing all information in a timely fashion."
"There are going to be some people that are not going to be pleased with this moving forward, tonight. But, that's just the way, unfortunately, as we know that these things occur."
"The only thing I'd point out - and, I know that the Councillor from the area feels very strongly about this. And, I credit her for having taken some leadership on this issue - would not disagree with the statement, that this is the first step in a complicated process, albeit, an important step - not the final step."
"And, there will be opportunities for public input, as we go through the other steps. And, I don't think I'm stating this incorrectly. And, I look to staff for support on that. And, I'm getting it."
"So, I do support - and, in fact, I did support this recommendation at the meeting that we held at the Bohemian [Club] in Waterdown and was even asked by the Press whether I supported the Committee Recommendation. I did then. And so, I remain committed. But, I was also committed in wanting to hear what the community - at least those representatives from the community - had to say. And, I think I've tried to fulfill that side of the equation, as well."
Mitchell as Deputy Mayor and Acting Chair : "Any questions for the Mayor? Mr. Mayor, you can have the Chair back."
Mayor DiIanni re-Chaired : "Thank you, very much."
"So, if we're ready for the vote on 5, then? All in favour of #5?" (hear councillors say carried)
"#6" (hear councillors say carried) "#7 .#9" (hear councillors say carried) "Councillor McCarthy, a Motion on the report, please."
McCarthy : "Thank you, Mr. Mayor. It's been Moved by myself, and Seconded by Councillor McHattie, that the 3 rd of the Public Works, Infrastructure and Environment Committee be adopted and the Information Section received."
Mayor DiIanni : "Thank you. All in favour?" (hear councillors say carried) "That's carried."
6.2 Planning and Economic Development Committee
Report 06-003, February 21,2006
(Pearson / Mitchell - CARRIED as Amended)
Mayor DiIanni : "Members of Council, the Planning and Ec[onomic] Development Committee presents its 3 rd report and respectfully recommends Item #1" (hear councillors say carried) "2" (hear councillors say carried; and hear a glass clink)
"2, Councillor Merulla."
REQUEST TO AMEND Item - " 2. Demolition Permit - 260 King Street East (PED06054) (Ward 2) (Item 5.2)
That the Director of Building and Licensing be authorized and directed to issue a demolition permit for 260 King Street East in accordance with By-Law 74-290 pursuant to the demolition control provisions of Section 33 of The Planning Act, as amended, subject to the following conditions:
(a) That the applicant has applied for and received a building permit for a replacement building on this property;
(b) That the said building permit specifies that the replacement building be erected within two years of the demolition of the existing building on this property;
(c) That the said building permit for the replacement building specifies if such replacement building is not erected within the said two year time limit, that the City be paid the sum of $340,000 ($20,000 for each of the seventeen dwelling units of the existing building that were demolished);
(d) That the applicant be required to register on title to the subject property (prior to issuance of the said demolition permit), notice of these conditions (including the directions to the City Clerk outlined in sub-section (e)) in a form satisfactory to the Director of Building and Licensing and to the City Solicitor; and,
(e) That if the said replacement building is not erected as required, the City Clerk be authorized to add the said sum, until payment thereof, as a lien or charge upon the property until paid. "
Motion to Amend
"That conditions for issuance of Demolition Permit for 260 King Street East be removed"
(Merulla / Bratina)
Motion to Change the Amendment
That the preamble contain an indication of the uniqueness of the project because of the funding and approvals from the Provincial and Federal Governments;
And, that the Motion be passed to include clauses (b) and (c) only. That clauses (a), (d) and (e) be dropped.
(McHattie)
Final Motion to Amend the original Motion
"That section (a) be deleted and replaced with the following: "(a) Given that the Provincial and Federal funding and approvals are in place for this project; "
(McHattie - CARRIED with final amending Motion)
Merulla : "I believe Councillor Bratina might have a Motion amending this particular item."
Bratina : "Well, through you, Mr. Mayor, I'm assured by Planning, that the - that Item 2, as it is written adequately supports the requirement of the proponent, Mr. Spallacci."
"This is with regard to the demolition permit for the, for 260 King Street East , Mr. Mayor. And, we had some discussions with Planning, as to how we could expe - that's one of those $117 million of development issues. And, Mr. Spallacci wishes to move quickly on it. And, I understand, Councillor, that this satisfies, Mr. Spallacci's request."
Merulla : "Well, I guess the issue - just to clarify - is that we have, within the downtown area, an issue surrounding, providing demolition permits."
"And, the fact is, in this particular case, the building permit, itself - the drawings aren't completed - however, this particular project is attached to Provincial and Federal funding, which really makes this project a goal - regardless of the demolition permit."
"The reason why we have this particular protectionist scenario within the actual by-law, is to prevent anyone from building a - oh, sorry - demolishing a building for a parking lot."
"In this particular case, we all know the project is moving forward with both Provincial and Federal funding. And, according to the way it's written, it seems that the Demolition Permit will not be granted until the Building Permit is granted."
"Now, the drawings aren't completed. So, if someone could correct me on that issue, I'd be glad to accept that correction. But - and nowhere in this particular report, does it state that the Demolition Permit would be granted prior to the Building Permit."
Mayor DiIanni : "Ms. Coveyduck."
Lee Ann Coveyduck - General Manager, Planning and Development : "Yes, through you, Mr. Chairman. Because this property is located in the central area, we do put certain conditions - as you can see, in the report that's before you. And, it is my understanding that the Building Permit has not been received. It is just a policy of Council, however. So, if Council did decide that they don't want to have all these conditions attached, that would certainly, you know, be within Council's purview to do that."
"In discussion with Councillor Bratina prior to this meeting, the Motion that he was anticipating Moving, tonight, is actually the exact same Motion that's before Council, tonight."
"So, you have a choice of Moving this one. Or, if you aren't satisfied with those conditions, you could - because it is only a policy of Council - approve this without those conditions being attached."
Mayor DiIanni : "But, will these conditions slow things down? I think everybody wants to see some movement, there."
"And, is your concern Councillor - Councillors, that this will bog things down, somehow?"
Merulla : "Well basically, they want to get on with the Demolition Permit while they're putting together the drawings for the Building Permit. At this point, this is slowing down the process."
"What they preferably would like to do is have the Demolition Permit granted expeditiously, so they can move on to the second phase, which will be the Building Permit - "
Mayor DiIanni : "What's the risk there staff - Ms. Coveyduck - if we simply allow it to come down?"
Lee Ann Coveyduck - General Manager, Planning and Development : "The risk would be that the applicant does not proceed with the plans that they have to construct the dwelling units."
Mayor DiIanni : "It's not a great looking building" (hear giggles from Council and gallery) "to tell you the truth. But, I understand that. However, as you heard the Councillor say - the Councillors say, this is a building, a project that has some Federal and Provincial money attached to it. I can't see it ." (couldn't make out next couple words of Mayor) "But, I'm at your disposal Council. So, give me a recommendation - "
MOTION to AMEND Item #2
"That conditions for issuance of Demolition Permit for 260 King Street East be removed
(Merulla / Bratina)
Merulla : "So, at the appropriate time, I will Move that these conditions be removed - "
Bratina : " - and, I'll Second it - "
Mayor DiIanni : "All right. So, Madam Clerk some direction. We've got a recommendation with conditions. Do we have to turn this down first and then take a new one, or what?"
Rose Caterini - Deputy Clerk/Manager of Legislative Services & Records : "You would take the amendment to remove the conditions, first."
Mayor DiIanni : "Okay, so the amendment is to remove the conditions. Moved by Councillor Merulla; Seconded by Councillor Bratina. And, Councillor Pearson wants to speak on that - on the Amendment." (hear a glass clink)
Pearson : "Thank you, Mr. Mayor. On the amendment, I'm just a little bit confused because one of the conditions in here is - and recognizing, I'm sure, the developer wants to move on - but, I really have concern that staff should really look at what implication this will put in place, as far as the City's position."
"Because, in one of the conditions, it says if the building's not erected - a new building is not erected within two years, we've got some conditions that protects the City. There's some City funding in there, also." (hear someone say something off microphone) "And, that's what I'm concerned of removing all the conditions. I'd rather feel - I'd feel more comfortable staff giving us an overview of what's actually, you know, safe for us to do, as a City." (hear a glass clink)
Mayor DiIanni : "So - good point - so, what will allow this to move forward, but also protect the City interest - especially when it comes to our own contribution. I guess that's the question, right?"
"Staff, do you have an answer to that - Ms. Coveyduck."
Lee Ann Coveyduck - General Manager, Planning and Development : "Through you, Mr. Mayor. If you want to protect the City, the best way to do that is by placing all these conditions on the property. Because, what we're saying here, is that prior to the Building Permit" [ sic , transcriber's thinks speaker may have meant to say 'Demolition Permit'] "being issued, that they have to apply for a Building Permit. And, if they don't complete this building within two years, that we take money so that we can make sure that it was - the demolition is done properly."
"So, to me you either have all of the conditions attached, or you can remove the conditions."
Mayor DiIanni : "It's all or none, you're saying."
"Councillor Merulla."
Merulla : "Just item (b), where it says: that the said permit - building permit for the replacement building specifies that if such replacement building is not erected within the said two year time limit, that the City be paid the sum of $340,000 - $20,000 for each of the 17 dwelling units of the existing building that were demolished."
"If we were to include that, that would have some sort of protection for the City, financially."
"But, I can assure you, that this project, as you know, this is a project that ties into Provincial and Federal funding through the SCPI" (Supporting Communities Partnership Initiative - http://www.myhamilton.ca/myhamilton/CityandGovernment/
HealthandSocialServices/SocialServices/Homelessness/SCPI-Main.htm ) "program and we approved the first phase of it. So, it's not - this was not business, as usual in the sense that this project - the probability of this project not moving forward is next to nil."
"All they're basically requiring - or asking for - is to expedite the demolition condition, so that they can move forward on the actual drawings, themselves. So, this is a multi-stakeholder approach, where we have all levels of government involved. And, the probability of this not going forward, is next to nil."
"So, perhaps we should speak to somebody from Housing, if they're here tonight, for those that don't understand what this project is all about, to expand upon the criteria that this particular company met to be granted the opportunity to build this building." (hear a glass clink)
Mayor DiIanni : "Ya, but here's what, here's what - if you read, carefully - the, you know - and I'll listen to what other Members have to say, or, if there's somebody from Housing - But, if you look at the stipulations, essentially (b) and (c) are the ones that talk about the money; they're tied together. But, the others are the assurances that we have, in terms of registering on title and the satisfaction of our senior staff in the Building Department that these things are done."
"So, it seems that they are tied. But, I'll listen to what you have to say - "
Merulla : "My concern is, Mr. Mayor, is that with all those monies - and we're talking millions of dollars that are being granted from the Provincial / Federal level. Again, unless they're willing to walk away from that incentive program, I'm not quite sure what the concern would be."
"I think the probability of that is next to nil. That's what I'm basically emphasizing." (hear a glass clink)
Mayor DiIanni : "Okay. Members of Council - Councillor Collins first, and then, Councillor Whitehead."
(Councillor Collins says off microphone that he believed Councillor McHattie was first.)
McHattie : "Thanks, Councillor Collins - "
Mayor DiIanni : " - thanks for helping me Chair. Go ahead - "
McHattie : "Yup" (hear giggles from Council and gallery) "Always useful to have that help."
"Mr. Mayor, I guess I can understand this project needs to move ahead and we do have the Provincial and Federal funding."
"I'm just wondering whether we can word this Motion in such a way as it identifies this project as a little bit unique. Perhaps the uniqueness is actually the Federal and Provincial funding being in place. So, if we could say something about, you know: Thereas, or Wherefore , the Federal and Provincial Funding's in place, here, we feel comfortable in going this direction."
"We're always concerned about setting precedents with this sort of thing. So, I think there's a way - and I look to Councillor Merulla for his word-smithing to maybe make reference to why this project is unique, in the Motion so we can feel some comfort that this doesn't set a substantial precedent for the Downtown area where we've been asking - almost every project that I'm aware of - for the, you know, the Building Permit, before we issue the Demolition Permit."
"So, I think we need that kind of comfort. So, if we can build that in, I think we can move ahead."
Mayor DiIanni : "Well, I'm at your disposal in terms of amendments. But, we do have a couple of other speakers. Councillor Collins."
Collins : "Same lines. I'm supportive of that. I guess I want the assurance that our, our conditions are in, in regards to our funding. But, in regards to the issuance of the Demolition Permit, I mean that - I think what Councillor Merulla's trying to get at is this building's going to happen regardless."
"And so, it's the early issuance of the Demolition Permit that's at hand, here. It's not the issue of our funding or anything else, that was listed in the report. And, so, I mean I - as was mentioned by our staff, it really is a Council policy. And, this is something we issued several years ago to prevent parking lots across the downtown for people who had grandiose plans to construct new buildings, but didn't go ahead with them. And, ended up with commercial parking lots."
"And so, knowing that we're not going to fall into that situation with this, as we have three levels of government who are funding it. The only issue is the early issuance of the Demolition Permit. So, I believe that the amendment would be that we issue the Demolition Permit with the existing conditions on the City's financing."
Mayor DiIanni : "So, breaking apart, the Demolition, on the one hand, and then the Building Permit on the other."
"What does that do, Mr. Coveyduck?"
Lee Ann Coveyduck - General Manager, Planning and Development : "In terms of the Demolition Permit, if that's what you want to do, I would suggest that you just approve it without the conditions, so that we can just issue the Permit. Because, if you tie it into the funding, I believe that the funding has already been committed. So, that condition has already been met with respect to funding."
"As long as they follow through on that project, then it shouldn't be a problem."
See Part #3
Continuing with Committee Reports 6.2 Item #5 of "Planning and Economic Development Committee," Report 06-003, February 21, 2006
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